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Stefanos Kapino
07 February 2018 18:54 Post ID: #999851 - in reply to #999827
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Calvin Plummer - 7/2/2018 17:16

toms - 7/2/2018 17:11

AdebolaCornflakes - 7/2/2018 14:52

There is always a place for youth. We haven't been shite these last few years because we've been blooding the likes of Osborn, Brereton, Cash and Worrall; it's largely been down to a shite defence which several managers have failed to strengthen.

It would be such a shame to see the players named above benched all of a sudden now we have some experienced players in. It strikes me that we have a pretty good balance between youth and experience now.


Sorry mate but none of the above are good enough to be consistently play in a promotion chasing team. Karanka knows this. The only people who think otherwise are idealists. We will end up hopefully being no different to other clubs, namely introducing only the very best youngsters for a few games and loaning out the rest

We will look back at the days of worrall, Smith, Osborn and cash with nostalgic fondness wishing them well for their loans at burton, reading, Brentford and derby




Definitely, injury prone aging players who aren't wanted by their current teams are the way to go.


Yet you celebrated the signing of Murphy and the extension to Fox, who are both exactly as you describe but more expensive and at least in Fox's case, shit
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07 February 2018 19:12 Post ID: #999854 - in reply to #999831
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AdebolaCornflakes - 7/2/2018 18:46

Perhaps with better players around them and a better organised manager they will develop into bigger assets for the club.

Anyone who has seen them play regularly will agree there is potential in all of them. It's hard to agree that Worrall isn't good enough for a promotion chasing second tier side when a top 7 Premier League side has just bid £13m for him, or that Brereton and Osborn aren't good enough when Klopp and Benitez have reportedly shown interest.


Hard to argue with that blatancy m8

They are plenty good enough, maybe some folk just dont appreciate that players peak at like 27 and everything up til then in progression and learning

id still give tyler benefit of the doubt too, after all, hes a natural goal poacher in a 2 up front team and hes had that about twice in his career
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07 February 2018 20:02 Post ID: #999862 - in reply to #999851
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Pope John XXIII - 7/2/2018 18:54

Calvin Plummer - 7/2/2018 17:16

toms - 7/2/2018 17:11

AdebolaCornflakes - 7/2/2018 14:52

There is always a place for youth. We haven't been shite these last few years because we've been blooding the likes of Osborn, Brereton, Cash and Worrall; it's largely been down to a shite defence which several managers have failed to strengthen.

It would be such a shame to see the players named above benched all of a sudden now we have some experienced players in. It strikes me that we have a pretty good balance between youth and experience now.


Sorry mate but none of the above are good enough to be consistently play in a promotion chasing team. Karanka knows this. The only people who think otherwise are idealists. We will end up hopefully being no different to other clubs, namely introducing only the very best youngsters for a few games and loaning out the rest

We will look back at the days of worrall, Smith, Osborn and cash with nostalgic fondness wishing them well for their loans at burton, reading, Brentford and derby




Definitely, injury prone aging players who aren't wanted by their current teams are the way to go.


Yet you celebrated the signing of Murphy and the extension to Fox, who are both exactly as you describe but more expensive and at least in Fox's case, shit


You live in some bizarre fantasy world, find any post of mine celebrating his signing. I was decidedly underwhelmed but saw the logic in it.

As for Fox *whoosh*
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07 February 2018 20:16 Post ID: #999864 - in reply to #999862
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Calvin Plummer - 7/2/2018 20:02

Pope John XXIII - 7/2/2018 18:54

Calvin Plummer - 7/2/2018 17:16

toms - 7/2/2018 17:11

AdebolaCornflakes - 7/2/2018 14:52

There is always a place for youth. We haven't been shite these last few years because we've been blooding the likes of Osborn, Brereton, Cash and Worrall; it's largely been down to a shite defence which several managers have failed to strengthen.

It would be such a shame to see the players named above benched all of a sudden now we have some experienced players in. It strikes me that we have a pretty good balance between youth and experience now.


Sorry mate but none of the above are good enough to be consistently play in a promotion chasing team. Karanka knows this. The only people who think otherwise are idealists. We will end up hopefully being no different to other clubs, namely introducing only the very best youngsters for a few games and loaning out the rest

We will look back at the days of worrall, Smith, Osborn and cash with nostalgic fondness wishing them well for their loans at burton, reading, Brentford and derby




Definitely, injury prone aging players who aren't wanted by their current teams are the way to go.


Yet you celebrated the signing of Murphy and the extension to Fox, who are both exactly as you describe but more expensive and at least in Fox's case, shit


You live in some bizarre fantasy world, find any post of mine celebrating his signing. I was decidedly underwhelmed but saw the logic in it.

As for Fox *whoosh*


No whoosh involved.

He's been dire.

Warburton's signings were, with one permenent exception, shocking.
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07 February 2018 20:42 Post ID: #999865 - in reply to #999781
Apparently Olimpiacos signed him for £2.5 million 2 years ago, played every game including champions league last season and then they cancelled his contract. Two weeks later he signs for us because "he likes us". Looks like the big man has a complete understanding of FFP to me. Join all the others that seem to be getting round it.
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07 February 2018 20:56 Post ID: #999867 - in reply to #999781
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When you put it like that jbacsta....
Eminently believable. Definitely.
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07 February 2018 20:58 Post ID: #999868 - in reply to #999808
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Sniffer Dog - 7/2/2018 14:49

in_the_top_one - 7/2/2018 14:14

It's not all black and white. There is a time/longevity element to consider as well.

It isn't necessarily wise to bring in players that will be decent for a couple of seasons max and ship out all the ones that might develop into good players over the next ten (and also increase in value over that time). Taking a snapshot of quality/contribution right now is not the full picture.
Losing any of Brereton, Osborn, Worrall and Smith, even for players who might be considered better right now, could be both short-sighted and unsustainable. The way we and others sack managers, though, long-sightedness and sustainability aren't high in any manager's list of priorities.
It is sense, not sentiment.

Most of us have advocated bringing through our quality youth. I don't want to see that policy completely abandoned.


It won't be completely abandoned mate but the youth needs to be good enough to get us to where we want to be.
The new owners are not going to fanny around and wait for years to bring a new generation of kids through. They want promotion and they want it now.
I know I keep saying it but they are ruthless winners, happier days are coming soon.


it's a fine line sniffer- if the gaffer has decided smith is not going to make it then fair enough. No one is asking youth for the sake of youth but it is a feature of clubs like us to be able to still produce players. Take that away from forest and we become that bit more like everyone else.

none of the glory kids are mistake free and i hope we don't ditch too many on the count of someone with an instant gratification issue. If the big man doesn't want to wait then go do a wolves- ah yes, he doesn't actually have that much money to spend, and even if he did, he would likely have to spend it in Greece.

Big supporter of marinakis so far but if we ditching sentiment then that's my opinion. Shame about smith but benefit of the doubt given. A position likely to change if I see all the kids getting shipped out and nothing coming through from the academy. Don't expect a whole team but when results are shit, i have enjoyed seeing younger players develop- reid, dawson, jenus, more recently jamaal, darlow, os and the NKOTB
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07 February 2018 20:59 Post ID: #999869 - in reply to #999854
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paz1967 - 7/2/2018 19:12

AdebolaCornflakes - 7/2/2018 18:46

Perhaps with better players around them and a better organised manager they will develop into bigger assets for the club.

Anyone who has seen them play regularly will agree there is potential in all of them. It's hard to agree that Worrall isn't good enough for a promotion chasing second tier side when a top 7 Premier League side has just bid £13m for him, or that Brereton and Osborn aren't good enough when Klopp and Benitez have reportedly shown interest.


Hard to argue with that blatancy m8

They are plenty good enough, maybe some folk just dont appreciate that players peak at like 27 and everything up til then in progression and learning

id still give tyler benefit of the doubt too, after all, hes a natural goal poacher in a 2 up front team and hes had that about twice in his career


2 good posts imo
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08 February 2018 03:55 Post ID: #999885 - in reply to #999864
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Pope John XXIII - 7/2/2018 20:16

Calvin Plummer - 7/2/2018 20:02

Pope John XXIII - 7/2/2018 18:54

Calvin Plummer - 7/2/2018 17:16

toms - 7/2/2018 17:11

AdebolaCornflakes - 7/2/2018 14:52

There is always a place for youth. We haven't been shite these last few years because we've been blooding the likes of Osborn, Brereton, Cash and Worrall; it's largely been down to a shite defence which several managers have failed to strengthen.

It would be such a shame to see the players named above benched all of a sudden now we have some experienced players in. It strikes me that we have a pretty good balance between youth and experience now.


Sorry mate but none of the above are good enough to be consistently play in a promotion chasing team. Karanka knows this. The only people who think otherwise are idealists. We will end up hopefully being no different to other clubs, namely introducing only the very best youngsters for a few games and loaning out the rest

We will look back at the days of worrall, Smith, Osborn and cash with nostalgic fondness wishing them well for their loans at burton, reading, Brentford and derby




Definitely, injury prone aging players who aren't wanted by their current teams are the way to go.


Yet you celebrated the signing of Murphy and the extension to Fox, who are both exactly as you describe but more expensive and at least in Fox's case, shit


You live in some bizarre fantasy world, find any post of mine celebrating his signing. I was decidedly underwhelmed but saw the logic in it.

As for Fox *whoosh*


No whoosh involved.

He's been dire.

Warburton's signings were, with one permenent exception, shocking.


So where is this post with me celebrating? Delusional tw@t.

Your obsession with MW is equally bizarre, this is a thread to discuss a potential new signing and in general to debate the ongoing transfer policy of the club. Trust me, everyone knows you didn't like him but you're reaching BRE/Toms levels of insanity now.

Edited by Calvin Plummer 8/2/2018 03:59
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08 February 2018 09:02 Post ID: #999897 - in reply to #999781
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Owd permenent.....
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08 February 2018 10:03 Post ID: #999900 - in reply to #999851
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Pope John XXIII - 7/2/2018 18:54

Calvin Plummer - 7/2/2018 17:16

toms - 7/2/2018 17:11

AdebolaCornflakes - 7/2/2018 14:52

There is always a place for youth. We haven't been shite these last few years because we've been blooding the likes of Osborn, Brereton, Cash and Worrall; it's largely been down to a shite defence which several managers have failed to strengthen.

It would be such a shame to see the players named above benched all of a sudden now we have some experienced players in. It strikes me that we have a pretty good balance between youth and experience now.


Sorry mate but none of the above are good enough to be consistently play in a promotion chasing team. Karanka knows this. The only people who think otherwise are idealists. We will end up hopefully being no different to other clubs, namely introducing only the very best youngsters for a few games and loaning out the rest

We will look back at the days of worrall, Smith, Osborn and cash with nostalgic fondness wishing them well for their loans at burton, reading, Brentford and derby




Definitely, injury prone aging players who aren't wanted by their current teams are the way to go.


Yet you celebrated the signing of Murphy and the extension to Fox, who are both exactly as you describe but more expensive and at least in Fox's case, shit


More expensive than what?

Do you honestly think that the new guys have all signed for bargain prices?

Geddy fell into the same category as Murphy; he had a contract to pay up (a longer contract than Murphy) so that he could move on a free.

Clubs have two choices when signing players on PL contracts; match the contract or pay the existing one up and then pay the player less over longer - clubs usually go for the second option so that the incoming player fits in with the existing pay structure

Could you seriously see Watson cancel his contract with Watford unless there was a lucrative signing on fee being dangled in front of him?

As glad as I am to see them all sign I don't think for one minute they are doing us a big favour by playing for nothing.

I'm not sure what your point is with Fox; he signed his contract extension in July 2016 which was under Fawaz's jurisdiction and prior to MW and EM having any influence.
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08 February 2018 10:18 Post ID: #999902 - in reply to #999865
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jbacsta - 7/2/2018 20:42

Apparently Olimpiacos signed him for £2.5 million 2 years ago, played every game including champions league last season and then they cancelled his contract. Two weeks later he signs for us because "he likes us". Looks like the big man has a complete understanding of FFP to me. Join all the others that seem to be getting round it.


That's not a bad effort!

Apart from the facts , that is!

He cost 2m euros not 2.5m pounds.

And he only played 18 out of 30 league games and very nearly all of their CL games last season.

I doubt that this guys worth in the transfer market would have any bearing whatsoever on FFP; 500K say, over three years would make his wages a far bigger burden.

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08 February 2018 10:21 Post ID: #999903 - in reply to #999900
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mao tse tung - 8/2/2018 10:03

Pope John XXIII - 7/2/2018 18:54

Calvin Plummer - 7/2/2018 17:16

toms - 7/2/2018 17:11

AdebolaCornflakes - 7/2/2018 14:52

There is always a place for youth. We haven't been shite these last few years because we've been blooding the likes of Osborn, Brereton, Cash and Worrall; it's largely been down to a shite defence which several managers have failed to strengthen.

It would be such a shame to see the players named above benched all of a sudden now we have some experienced players in. It strikes me that we have a pretty good balance between youth and experience now.


Sorry mate but none of the above are good enough to be consistently play in a promotion chasing team. Karanka knows this. The only people who think otherwise are idealists. We will end up hopefully being no different to other clubs, namely introducing only the very best youngsters for a few games and loaning out the rest

We will look back at the days of worrall, Smith, Osborn and cash with nostalgic fondness wishing them well for their loans at burton, reading, Brentford and derby




Definitely, injury prone aging players who aren't wanted by their current teams are the way to go.


Yet you celebrated the signing of Murphy and the extension to Fox, who are both exactly as you describe but more expensive and at least in Fox's case, shit


More expensive than what?

Do you honestly think that the new guys have all signed for bargain prices?

Geddy fell into the same category as Murphy; he had a contract to pay up (a longer contract than Murphy) so that he could move on a free.

Clubs have two choices when signing players on PL contracts; match the contract or pay the existing one up and then pay the player less over longer - clubs usually go for the second option so that the incoming player fits in with the existing pay structure

Could you seriously see Watson cancel his contract with Watford unless there was a lucrative signing on fee being dangled in front of him?

As glad as I am to see them all sign I don't think for one minute they are doing us a big favour by playing for nothing.

I'm not sure what your point is with Fox; he signed his contract extension in July 2016 which was under Fawaz's jurisdiction and prior to MW and EM having any influence.


I'm referring to Murphy's fee. Yes, perhaps that was offsetting wages for FFP purposes but it still amounts to £2m plus weekly wages for 3 years- a fair whack of money.

I'm under no illusions about the new signings being cheap, but Fox isn't cheap either for his contribution.

We haven't made many long term commitments this window-shopping a couple of 2 year contracts to slightly older players is being played up as bad business by certain people
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08 February 2018 10:38 Post ID: #999904 - in reply to #999781
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Honestly, I really can't see anything wrong with having 3 or 4 thirty somethings about the place.
Plus last time I checked all the youngsters were still here.
So...
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08 February 2018 12:11 Post ID: #999906 - in reply to #999903
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Pope John XXIII - 8/2/2018 10:21

mao tse tung - 8/2/2018 10:03

Pope John XXIII - 7/2/2018 18:54

Calvin Plummer - 7/2/2018 17:16

toms - 7/2/2018 17:11

AdebolaCornflakes - 7/2/2018 14:52

There is always a place for youth. We haven't been shite these last few years because we've been blooding the likes of Osborn, Brereton, Cash and Worrall; it's largely been down to a shite defence which several managers have failed to strengthen.

It would be such a shame to see the players named above benched all of a sudden now we have some experienced players in. It strikes me that we have a pretty good balance between youth and experience now.


Sorry mate but none of the above are good enough to be consistently play in a promotion chasing team. Karanka knows this. The only people who think otherwise are idealists. We will end up hopefully being no different to other clubs, namely introducing only the very best youngsters for a few games and loaning out the rest

We will look back at the days of worrall, Smith, Osborn and cash with nostalgic fondness wishing them well for their loans at burton, reading, Brentford and derby




Definitely, injury prone aging players who aren't wanted by their current teams are the way to go.


Yet you celebrated the signing of Murphy and the extension to Fox, who are both exactly as you describe but more expensive and at least in Fox's case, shit


More expensive than what?

Do you honestly think that the new guys have all signed for bargain prices?

Geddy fell into the same category as Murphy; he had a contract to pay up (a longer contract than Murphy) so that he could move on a free.

Clubs have two choices when signing players on PL contracts; match the contract or pay the existing one up and then pay the player less over longer - clubs usually go for the second option so that the incoming player fits in with the existing pay structure

Could you seriously see Watson cancel his contract with Watford unless there was a lucrative signing on fee being dangled in front of him?

As glad as I am to see them all sign I don't think for one minute they are doing us a big favour by playing for nothing.

I'm not sure what your point is with Fox; he signed his contract extension in July 2016 which was under Fawaz's jurisdiction and prior to MW and EM having any influence.


I'm referring to Murphy's fee. Yes, perhaps that was offsetting wages for FFP purposes but it still amounts to £2m plus weekly wages for 3 years- a fair whack of money.

I'm under no illusions about the new signings being cheap, but Fox isn't cheap either for his contribution.

We haven't made many long term commitments this window-shopping a couple of 2 year contracts to slightly older players is being played up as bad business by certain people


It is a fair whack of money but you are looking at around 1m to cancel his Newcastle contract and then a signing on fee; Geddy had longer to run on his contract so I would imagine we have paid slightly more than 2m.

But that is what the market demands; Forshaw left Middlesboro for Leeds and a figure in excess of 4m was quoted; he had a contract running to 2020 so the best part of the fee quoted would have been compensation.

The players are milking it at every single stage of their careers now regardless of age.

But I completely agree about our contract commitments; we now appear to be operating to a financial plan, at long last.
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08 February 2018 12:17 Post ID: #999907 - in reply to #999904
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Sniffer Dog - 8/2/2018 10:38

Honestly, I really can't see anything wrong with having 3 or 4 thirty somethings about the place.
Plus last time I checked all the youngsters were still here.
So...


The type of player we have just purchased will greatly benefit the development of the youngsters, not hinder their progress.

We have a far more balanced squad now that we did at the start of the season.

Another three or four out in the summer, replaced by better quality, and we can start to look at a top six position next season.
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08 February 2018 12:23 Post ID: #999908 - in reply to #999781
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If we are really signing Kapino, which looks very likely, I would say Pantilimon will last no longer than his loan period; he is under contract at Watford for two more years and I would guess that he will be well out of reach as far as wages are concerned.
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